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welcome everybody I have an interview

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coming up in a minute with the very

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excellent doctor Penny Sartori

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about her new book the transformative

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power of near-death experiences

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interesting book you know I've covered

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near-death experiences a lot and I

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always have a little bit of a different

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take on it it's especially fun to talk

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to such an accomplished scientific

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researcher as dr. penny Sartori but I

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wanted to contrast that with a little

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movie clip maybe this one Code Blue Room

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1:34 you know there's nothing quite like

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Seth MacFarlane

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in a teddy bear costume I just never

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could bring myself to watch those movies

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but but it's an interesting cultural

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overlay on this topic of near-death

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experience because of course one of the

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questions is how to what extent is the

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medical establishment responsible for

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this overwhelming fear of death we have

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and to what extent does near-death

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experience relieve that fear of death

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and lessen the grief associated with

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death as we've talked about before it

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clearly does it's kind of overwhelming

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better than any other treatment we know

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of but what extent is medicine

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responsible for perpetuating it or are

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they just kind of reflecting what we

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already feel believe and have culturally

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instilled in our us and our kids and all

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the rest of that so that's one of the

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topics we talked about today with dr.

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Sarah Torrey

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we also talked about this light in-love

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thing which i think is so interesting

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it's really the focus of her latest book

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it coincides really with the data if you

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look at dr. Jeff long he's collected the

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data and it's certainly about light and

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love 80 to 90 percent of the

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I'm but what about those other times

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what about the hellish death experiences

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what about the black void that some

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people face and fear so greatly so those

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are a couple of things we talked about

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we also talked about the connection

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between near-death experience and other

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transformative experiences very very

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interesting stuff from just a terrific

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guest who really does have a great new

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book I hope you check out the

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transformative power of near-death

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experiences my interview with dr. penny

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Sartori is coming up next on skeptical

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today we welcome NDE researcher and

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author dr. penny Sartori to skeptic Oh

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dr. Sartori has along with Kelly Walsh

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who you'll hear about in a minute they

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have written a new book titled here it

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is if you watching this video the

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transformative power of near-death

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experiences how the messages of NDEs

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positively impact the world and she's

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here to talk about that so penny

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welcome to skeptic oh you've been on one

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button one time before but I didn't have

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the pleasure of talking to you directly

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I think that time so thanks so much for

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joining me

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oh you're welcome hi Alex really nice to

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be here well it's nice to have you on in

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this new book is like I was saying it

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really is terrific we have a lot to talk

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about this book is very inspirational

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the stories are fascinating and I know

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you're very humble about your

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contributions visa vie your writing

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partner Kelly Walsh but I think you

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bring so much to this work and in

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particularly for for me and for skeptic

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oh because we are always interested in

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being grounded in the science of this

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things and I think that's really so much

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about what you do and who you are

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because you are a scientist you're a PhD

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you have this interesting balance they

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tell people about your background who

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don't know you and then a little bit

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about how your background relates

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directly to this really terrific new

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book well I used to work as a nurse and

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I was in intensive care for 17 years and

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because of the nature of my job I saw

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death on a daily basis and it was one

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night shift in particular and I was

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looking after a dying patient and he had

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a really unpleasant death and it really

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very much upset me and it's something

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that really made me think what happens

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when we die what is death all

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and at that point you know I hadn't

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really thought a great deal about it and

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that it upset me so much it just set me

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on this kind of like path really to have

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to learn about death and the more I read

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about death the more interested I became

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and then someone gave me a book and it

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was Betty Edie's book called embraced by

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the light and I can remember reading

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that and I was thinking wow this just

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seems such an amazing thing what if this

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is real you know because my nursing

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background I was really quite skeptical

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at first and I thought it's gotta be

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some sort of hallucination or maybe it's

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the way that the brain is dying down but

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I think what the more I read about these

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the more I inspired I became to read

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more and I was just fascinated and I

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thought when I'm working in intensive

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care maybe I can do my own study and

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that's what I did I kind of been and

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that all kind of came about and I had

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professor Paul Bardem and dr. Peter

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fennec who is they're both experts in

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the field of near-death experiences and

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it was just a wonderful thing to be able

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to connect with with patients and find

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out what it is that they recalled from

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the time that they were unconscious

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because it's something I've never taken

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a time to ask about before you know so

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well you know that I idea of that that

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study which I've referenced so many

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times on the show because you know

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there's so many ways to break down this

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topic of near-death experience and as

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we're just talking about in this book

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that you've written it's it's very

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inspirational and that's terrific I mean

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there's a lot to there's a lot to be

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inspired about and there's a lot of

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cultural change that needs to go around

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this but the scientific angle and that's

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what I always thought was terrific about

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this research is as you know there's

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been this ongoing debate well you it's

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it's not scientific they're just these

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anecdotal accounts and besides you could

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never study this scientifically and I

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always like to point people to your

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research and I say no here's really a

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wonderfully simple experiment that was

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done

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that one both adds incredible scientific

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evidence suggesting the reality of

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near-death experiences but also shows us

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a path how you can you can apply science

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to this can you just go over in in broad

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strokes the study that you did about

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people's recollection of their

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resuscitation and how the one control

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how the control group was set up and how

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that was basically done okay so what I

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did was over the period of five years I

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interviewed for the first year I

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interviewed every single patient who

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survived their admission to the

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intensive care unit and I wanted to make

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sure that I didn't miss any patients and

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what I found at the end of the first

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year was that I was actually spending

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longer in the hospital than I was at

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home so I couldn't sustain that for the

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following five four years though what I

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thought what I did then is I narrowed

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down that the kind of the group I was

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interviewing so I only approached

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patients who had undergone cardiac

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arrest and survived

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and although the sample was a little

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smaller than the first year what I found

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is that in 30 out of 39 patients who had

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been successfully resuscitated seven of

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them recalled a near-death experience

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and that's you know it's nearly 18

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percent of patients who survived cardiac

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arrest had this kind of experience and

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what I also did is I documented their

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blood results at the time I looked at

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the drugs that were given and I also

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interviewed the staff members who were

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looking after the patients of the nurses

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and the doctors I asked them if one of

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the page if the patients reported the

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out-of-body component I would then try

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and verify what it was they were what

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they described I would I verified that

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within the nurses and the doctors who

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were looking after them with the control

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group I had then patients who'd been

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successfully resuscitated but they

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didn't have a near-death experience so

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they didn't have the antibody component

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and I asked them if they could describe

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what they thought that we had done to

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them and

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like what do you mean I don't I was dead

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I don't remember anything right exactly

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that's right and they were saying why

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are you asking me this I have no idea

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what you did to me at all like and the

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majority of them couldn't even guess

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they couldn't make a guess as to what

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we've done and then a few of them then

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did make a guess and it was based on T V

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Hospital dramas that they've been

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watching and what I found is that there

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were errors and misconceptions in what

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they thought we had done to them and so

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some of them thought that they had been

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DC shocked with the paddles and they

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hadn't those people had just had the

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resuscitation the CPR and drugs

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administered such as adrenaline or

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noradrenaline and then some of them made

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educated guesses but the police where

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they thought that we put the paddles on

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to their body was completely erroneous

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it was wrong it was incorrect you know

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this is great stuff yeah so it just you

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know it just goes to show that the

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people who did report their near-death

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experience described their experience

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with accuracy whereas the control group

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would wince accurate and they most of

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them couldn't even hazard a guess and so

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you know it just makes you think well it

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does more than make you think right I

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mean because again to me that the great

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thing about it is is in this ongoing

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debate which I guess we have to talk

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about as well but in this ongoing debate

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among people who claim to have some

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scientific agenda that makes them

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diametrically opposed to this science

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which doesn't make any sense I mean I

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don't know but but the the claim has

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always been there's you can't prove it

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there's no scientific evidence of it and

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you know this what you've done and

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continue to do directly flies in the

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face of that but I want to return to

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really talking about the book the new

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book the transformative power of

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near-death experiences because in the

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conclusion to that book you write

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that your main purpose was to further

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this public understanding of and

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awareness of the near-death experience

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and I guess my first thought was like

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wow are we still there were still you

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know and these are real kind of thing

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haven't we got past that but then I

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guess you know the more I read and in

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particular you're kind of fiery pushback

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against the medical community and some

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of the problems that it has in really

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wrapping itself around some of these

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ideas I was like yeah I mean that's work

275
00:12:32,780 --> 00:12:29,699
that does continue to go on do you want

276
00:12:34,579 --> 00:12:32,790
to speak to that a little bit yeah now

277
00:12:37,430 --> 00:12:34,589
one of the things that I find is that

278
00:12:39,800 --> 00:12:37,440
you know still people are not educated

279
00:12:42,019 --> 00:12:39,810
about near-death experiences and what

280
00:12:44,060 --> 00:12:42,029
they are so you know when someone has a

281
00:12:46,579 --> 00:12:44,070
near-death experience they wake up in

282
00:12:48,530 --> 00:12:46,589
the intensive care unit and they're like

283
00:12:50,360 --> 00:12:48,540
well what's just happening to me and

284
00:12:53,870 --> 00:12:50,370
very often they're afraid to talk about

285
00:12:56,449 --> 00:12:53,880
it or they're afraid to share it I think

286
00:12:58,460 --> 00:12:56,459
what would be really really important is

287
00:13:01,220 --> 00:12:58,470
that if nurses and doctors are trained

288
00:13:04,970 --> 00:13:01,230
to recognize if a patient has an

289
00:13:06,620 --> 00:13:04,980
experience or to gently say to them when

290
00:13:09,170 --> 00:13:06,630
you are unconscious you might have had

291
00:13:11,629 --> 00:13:09,180
something unusual happening and so it

292
00:13:13,879 --> 00:13:11,639
leads then it gives them that option to

293
00:13:16,309 --> 00:13:13,889
discuss what they've experienced as well

294
00:13:18,980 --> 00:13:16,319
because a lot of people have this

295
00:13:21,079 --> 00:13:18,990
psychological turmoil if they're unable

296
00:13:23,449 --> 00:13:21,089
to understand their experience or

297
00:13:26,780 --> 00:13:23,459
integrate it into their life so it's

298
00:13:28,910 --> 00:13:26,790
crucial that on their recovery or when

299
00:13:31,189 --> 00:13:28,920
they regain consciousness that there is

300
00:13:34,400 --> 00:13:31,199
that supportive environment in which

301
00:13:36,680 --> 00:13:34,410
they can share their experience and try

302
00:13:38,449 --> 00:13:36,690
to make sense of it now all the nurses

303
00:13:40,250 --> 00:13:38,459
or doctors have to do at that point is

304
00:13:42,470 --> 00:13:40,260
to validate that they've had an

305
00:13:44,960 --> 00:13:42,480
experience that other patients have

306
00:13:46,730 --> 00:13:44,970
reported and then further down the line

307
00:13:48,430 --> 00:13:46,740
they could report that you know you they

308
00:13:51,679 --> 00:13:48,440
could refer them to further resources

309
00:13:54,319 --> 00:13:51,689
such as online groups or you know

310
00:13:56,090 --> 00:13:54,329
internet sources or books or whatever it

311
00:13:57,830 --> 00:13:56,100
is that you help

312
00:14:01,910 --> 00:13:57,840
you know but penny all that sounds well

313
00:14:05,150 --> 00:14:01,920
and good until you really look at some

314
00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:05,160
of these experiences and what it does in

315
00:14:12,050 --> 00:14:08,010
this book I in one of the early chapters

316
00:14:15,170 --> 00:14:12,060
your co-author Kelly tells very openly

317
00:14:19,010 --> 00:14:15,180
about her near-death experience but she

318
00:14:21,380 --> 00:14:19,020
also tells about this spiritual

319
00:14:23,660 --> 00:14:21,390
transformation that she undergoes in the

320
00:14:26,180 --> 00:14:23,670
hospital and for those you know you

321
00:14:29,360 --> 00:14:26,190
haven't read it she wakes up and she is

322
00:14:33,620 --> 00:14:29,370
singing singing these Christian kind of

323
00:14:38,060 --> 00:14:33,630
things that I mean it would be almost

324
00:14:40,580 --> 00:14:38,070
impossible to accept or expect a medical

325
00:14:42,080 --> 00:14:40,590
staff to embrace them the way that she

326
00:14:44,510 --> 00:14:42,090
did the way that she was I mean they

327
00:14:47,480 --> 00:14:44,520
were very accepting but I mean wow I

328
00:14:49,430 --> 00:14:47,490
mean that's almost too much to ask and

329
00:14:52,940 --> 00:14:49,440
they did sedate her a little bit which

330
00:14:55,670 --> 00:14:52,950
you can understand why so it's tricky

331
00:14:57,020 --> 00:14:55,680
isn't it because it's really easy to say

332
00:14:58,760 --> 00:14:57,030
oh you know the medical staff should be

333
00:15:01,190 --> 00:14:58,770
supportive and shouldn't be completely

334
00:15:04,520 --> 00:15:01,200
you know ready to send someone to the

335
00:15:06,800 --> 00:15:04,530
loony bin when they say they saw God but

336
00:15:10,250 --> 00:15:06,810
on the other hand some of these

337
00:15:13,010 --> 00:15:10,260
experiences that people have are really

338
00:15:14,900 --> 00:15:13,020
really strange yeah they are you know

339
00:15:17,360 --> 00:15:14,910
like Kelly's and she said you know she

340
00:15:18,829 --> 00:15:17,370
was trying to escape the ward she was

341
00:15:20,600 --> 00:15:18,839
naked she was trying to get off the ward

342
00:15:22,100 --> 00:15:20,610
she felt like she that was it there was

343
00:15:23,720 --> 00:15:22,110
nothing wrong with that now she was fine

344
00:15:27,079 --> 00:15:23,730
and she was saying that she's been

345
00:15:29,210 --> 00:15:27,089
talking to God and the angels and you

346
00:15:30,770 --> 00:15:29,220
know for someone who has absolutely no

347
00:15:33,920 --> 00:15:30,780
knowledge of these spiritually

348
00:15:37,340 --> 00:15:33,930
transformative experiences that can make

349
00:15:39,770 --> 00:15:37,350
them appear as if they are mentally

350
00:15:41,870 --> 00:15:39,780
unstable so I think it's important that

351
00:15:44,420 --> 00:15:41,880
health care workers are trained to

352
00:15:47,329 --> 00:15:44,430
recognize the possibility that these

353
00:15:49,820 --> 00:15:47,339
experiences can that these patients can

354
00:15:52,160 --> 00:15:49,830
be in the beginning or the acute phase

355
00:15:54,860 --> 00:15:52,170
of a spiritually transformative

356
00:15:57,020 --> 00:15:54,870
experience so that then further down the

357
00:15:58,880 --> 00:15:57,030
line there is more support that can be

358
00:16:03,140 --> 00:15:58,890
put into place for these patients as

359
00:16:04,610 --> 00:16:03,150
well I think it's so important you know

360
00:16:08,540 --> 00:16:04,620
one of the things I wanted to talk about

361
00:16:09,070 --> 00:16:08,550
and it's kind of a touchy subject but I

362
00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:09,080
think

363
00:16:15,370 --> 00:16:13,010
you're the perfect person to really kind

364
00:16:19,890 --> 00:16:15,380
of put some of this out there and really

365
00:16:21,280 --> 00:16:19,900
Mull it over this book is extremely

366
00:16:23,560 --> 00:16:21,290
positive

367
00:16:25,930 --> 00:16:23,570
it's about positivity Kelley is all

368
00:16:29,350 --> 00:16:25,940
about that's her brand is positivity and

369
00:16:32,920 --> 00:16:29,360
it's about light and love and that the

370
00:16:36,100 --> 00:16:32,930
NDE experience transforms our fear of

371
00:16:39,880 --> 00:16:36,110
death and and helps us overcome grief

372
00:16:41,710 --> 00:16:39,890
two important scientific findings we

373
00:16:42,940 --> 00:16:41,720
have from a psychological perspective we

374
00:16:44,350 --> 00:16:42,950
know those two things that those things

375
00:16:47,080 --> 00:16:44,360
are very important when you consider

376
00:16:49,660 --> 00:16:47,090
everything we do to treat people who

377
00:16:51,120 --> 00:16:49,670
have a fear of death there or experience

378
00:16:53,920 --> 00:16:51,130
grief and we have all sorts of

379
00:16:55,870 --> 00:16:53,930
medications and other things lined up

380
00:16:57,310 --> 00:16:55,880
for those people and yet you know here's

381
00:16:59,770 --> 00:16:57,320
something that has an amazing

382
00:17:02,950 --> 00:16:59,780
transformative power but my real point

383
00:17:06,579 --> 00:17:02,960
was the light and love and positivity

384
00:17:09,220 --> 00:17:06,589
thing because I'm one hand I'm all about

385
00:17:13,150 --> 00:17:09,230
that and I'm all about you know one of

386
00:17:16,030 --> 00:17:13,160
my best teachers all along said you know

387
00:17:20,170 --> 00:17:16,040
the secret to the ascent is to always

388
00:17:23,740 --> 00:17:20,180
look up and to and I think that also I

389
00:17:25,420 --> 00:17:23,750
don't only believe that from my personal

390
00:17:28,480 --> 00:17:25,430
experience and from what I've learned

391
00:17:31,330 --> 00:17:28,490
but the data leads us there to it leads

392
00:17:34,770 --> 00:17:31,340
us towards light and love being the

393
00:17:38,890 --> 00:17:34,780
overwhelming experience that people have

394
00:17:41,880 --> 00:17:38,900
but it's all but coming here it's not

395
00:17:44,980 --> 00:17:41,890
all light and love some people have very

396
00:17:48,300 --> 00:17:44,990
dark experiences some people are broken

397
00:17:50,470 --> 00:17:48,310
from near-death experiences in a way

398
00:17:53,680 --> 00:17:50,480
certainly some people have a lot of

399
00:17:55,960 --> 00:17:53,690
trouble integrating back in to their

400
00:17:58,360 --> 00:17:55,970
life with their near this experience and

401
00:18:00,610 --> 00:17:58,370
then we have the whole other aspect of

402
00:18:04,030 --> 00:18:00,620
it which is as we're just talking about

403
00:18:06,070 --> 00:18:04,040
we have a medical community that they

404
00:18:08,530 --> 00:18:06,080
don't seem to be they have an ulterior

405
00:18:11,230 --> 00:18:08,540
motive in the light and love thing as

406
00:18:12,490 --> 00:18:11,240
well so there's a lot to pull apart

407
00:18:14,340 --> 00:18:12,500
there and I want to spend some time

408
00:18:17,340 --> 00:18:14,350
doing it

409
00:18:20,220 --> 00:18:17,350
let's just start though with your

410
00:18:25,499 --> 00:18:20,230
general thoughts on the light and love

411
00:18:26,730 --> 00:18:25,509
and positivity versus not so much well

412
00:18:29,430 --> 00:18:26,740
with the light - nerve and the

413
00:18:32,009 --> 00:18:29,440
positivity that seems to be when people

414
00:18:33,659 --> 00:18:32,019
are able to really integrate their

415
00:18:35,639 --> 00:18:33,669
experience and they have that good

416
00:18:37,289 --> 00:18:35,649
support to do it now this isn't

417
00:18:40,409 --> 00:18:37,299
something that happens overnight either

418
00:18:43,139 --> 00:18:40,419
this is it's a process so it can take

419
00:18:44,999 --> 00:18:43,149
months it can take years in many cases

420
00:18:47,299 --> 00:18:45,009
you know I've got people who have

421
00:18:49,919 --> 00:18:47,309
contacted me and they'll ask for

422
00:18:51,779 --> 00:18:49,929
questions and help with understand in

423
00:18:53,399 --> 00:18:51,789
their experience and they'll come back

424
00:18:55,049 --> 00:18:53,409
to me a few years later and ask more

425
00:18:57,210 --> 00:18:55,059
questions and you know there's one

426
00:18:59,279 --> 00:18:57,220
person who I being in touch with in 10

427
00:19:01,019 --> 00:18:59,289
years we've been off and on emailing and

428
00:19:02,940 --> 00:19:01,029
finally she feels that she's in the

429
00:19:05,580 --> 00:19:02,950
place where she really gets it and she's

430
00:19:08,220 --> 00:19:05,590
fully integrated it and fully understand

431
00:19:10,350 --> 00:19:08,230
it understanding of what's happened to

432
00:19:12,240 --> 00:19:10,360
her but you know it's not an easy thing

433
00:19:14,490 --> 00:19:12,250
to process because there's a lot of

434
00:19:16,889 --> 00:19:14,500
adjustments that come after a near-death

435
00:19:19,049 --> 00:19:16,899
experience it's a it's a total change in

436
00:19:20,789 --> 00:19:19,059
the person's values so everything

437
00:19:23,490 --> 00:19:20,799
changes their ethics change you know

438
00:19:25,499 --> 00:19:23,500
their morals change and sometimes you

439
00:19:27,600 --> 00:19:25,509
know they they haven't they change their

440
00:19:29,460 --> 00:19:27,610
job because they're no longer aligned

441
00:19:31,710 --> 00:19:29,470
with what they were doing in their

442
00:19:33,990 --> 00:19:31,720
previous job they feel like it's all

443
00:19:36,060 --> 00:19:34,000
it's not right and and so they leave

444
00:19:38,610 --> 00:19:36,070
their job you know and there's all that

445
00:19:40,440 --> 00:19:38,620
angst that goes with it there's a high

446
00:19:43,830 --> 00:19:40,450
divorce rate as well you know a lot of

447
00:19:46,049 --> 00:19:43,840
people no longer recognize their spouses

448
00:19:47,759 --> 00:19:46,059
because they've changed that much and so

449
00:19:51,299 --> 00:19:47,769
it can lead to that division between

450
00:19:53,460 --> 00:19:51,309
them as well and so the integration of

451
00:19:56,190 --> 00:19:53,470
the experience is crucial and I think

452
00:19:57,600 --> 00:19:56,200
that's where medical personnel come in

453
00:20:00,210 --> 00:19:57,610
because they can really help with that

454
00:20:03,389 --> 00:20:00,220
if they were trained in how to deal with

455
00:20:07,080 --> 00:20:03,399
near-death experiences but then you've

456
00:20:10,169 --> 00:20:07,090
also got the really scary distress in

457
00:20:12,840 --> 00:20:10,179
near-death experiences which is so much

458
00:20:14,999 --> 00:20:12,850
more difficult to to research because no

459
00:20:16,409 --> 00:20:15,009
one wants to talk about them you know

460
00:20:19,019 --> 00:20:16,419
there's not many researchers want to

461
00:20:21,869 --> 00:20:19,029
talk about them either and I had a few

462
00:20:24,450 --> 00:20:21,879
of the distressing cases in my Hospital

463
00:20:27,060 --> 00:20:24,460
research as well and I can remember

464
00:20:27,590 --> 00:20:27,070
talking to this one lady she's had a

465
00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:27,600
card

466
00:20:33,080 --> 00:20:29,970
arrest and when I was interviewing there

467
00:20:34,640 --> 00:20:33,090
on the ward she started she's told me

468
00:20:37,460 --> 00:20:34,650
about the beginning of the experience

469
00:20:39,080 --> 00:20:37,470
and then she said oh it was like then I

470
00:20:42,350 --> 00:20:39,090
started looking I could see the flames

471
00:20:45,260 --> 00:20:42,360
rising and I I was looking into hell I

472
00:20:47,510 --> 00:20:45,270
could feel the flames of hell and then

473
00:20:49,940 --> 00:20:47,520
she started to cry and she really really

474
00:20:51,680 --> 00:20:49,950
became distressed and it was to the

475
00:20:54,919 --> 00:20:51,690
point where I had to terminate that him

476
00:20:56,630 --> 00:20:54,929
to be with her and she was begging me

477
00:20:58,340 --> 00:20:56,640
afterward she said please tell me that's

478
00:21:00,440 --> 00:20:58,350
not going to happen when they died and

479
00:21:02,960 --> 00:21:00,450
what the only thing I could say is that

480
00:21:05,330 --> 00:21:02,970
some of these experiences start off in a

481
00:21:07,250 --> 00:21:05,340
very distressing way but then sometimes

482
00:21:09,710 --> 00:21:07,260
they can change into that pleasant

483
00:21:11,570 --> 00:21:09,720
experience as well and that was the only

484
00:21:13,669 --> 00:21:11,580
thing I could say at the time to really

485
00:21:16,310 --> 00:21:13,679
kind of help her and it didn't help

486
00:21:19,580 --> 00:21:16,320
really I went back to see the lady about

487
00:21:21,740 --> 00:21:19,590
two days later and she said I just

488
00:21:24,620 --> 00:21:21,750
really can't talk about it anymore it's

489
00:21:24,980 --> 00:21:24,630
too distressing for me and so I left it

490
00:21:27,080 --> 00:21:24,990
at that

491
00:21:28,820 --> 00:21:27,090
and then when I followed her up a few

492
00:21:31,850 --> 00:21:28,830
months later she'd actually died as well

493
00:21:34,370 --> 00:21:31,860
and you know one thing I remember is

494
00:21:37,220 --> 00:21:34,380
when I was a student nurse and at the

495
00:21:39,799 --> 00:21:37,230
time we had no idea about how to treat

496
00:21:43,279 --> 00:21:39,809
this particular lady because she was

497
00:21:45,590 --> 00:21:43,289
terrified of dying and I can remember we

498
00:21:48,590 --> 00:21:45,600
every time we used to pass her bedside

499
00:21:51,380 --> 00:21:48,600
she would try and grab on to us and hold

500
00:21:53,990 --> 00:21:51,390
us and her nails would dig into our

501
00:21:56,980 --> 00:21:54,000
flesh and she'd say please don't let me

502
00:22:00,500 --> 00:21:56,990
die like that before and it's not nice

503
00:22:03,260 --> 00:22:00,510
we didn't understand that so we chatted

504
00:22:05,060 --> 00:22:03,270
with her family and the family said well

505
00:22:07,460 --> 00:22:05,070
you know about five years ago she did

506
00:22:10,010 --> 00:22:07,470
have a cardiac arrest but we don't know

507
00:22:12,110 --> 00:22:10,020
anything more now on reflection and

508
00:22:14,810 --> 00:22:12,120
having that had the benefit of doing

509
00:22:17,390 --> 00:22:14,820
this research I think it's possible that

510
00:22:19,190 --> 00:22:17,400
that lady had how to de-stress in the a

511
00:22:22,370 --> 00:22:19,200
deaf experience at the time that she'd

512
00:22:25,039 --> 00:22:22,380
had that cardiac arrest and so she was

513
00:22:26,390 --> 00:22:25,049
really quite terrified as well but of

514
00:22:28,610 --> 00:22:26,400
course there's a lot of stigma and

515
00:22:30,529 --> 00:22:28,620
involved with the distressing kind of

516
00:22:33,200 --> 00:22:30,539
experiences because a lot of people feel

517
00:22:35,840 --> 00:22:33,210
what have I done am ia bad person that I

518
00:22:37,970 --> 00:22:35,850
had this distress and experience you

519
00:22:39,680 --> 00:22:37,980
know and it's not that at all you know

520
00:22:41,630 --> 00:22:39,690
even people have really good moral

521
00:22:43,720 --> 00:22:41,640
character they can still have

522
00:22:45,770 --> 00:22:43,730
an unpleasant and distressing experience

523
00:22:47,630 --> 00:22:45,780
but don't we have to be careful there

524
00:22:51,110 --> 00:22:47,640
because we can't say we can't say either

525
00:22:55,039 --> 00:22:51,120
way I mean that's really the point is we

526
00:22:58,850 --> 00:22:55,049
don't know and and I also think that it

527
00:23:03,260 --> 00:22:58,860
also speaks to the idiosyncratic nature

528
00:23:06,710 --> 00:23:03,270
of these experiences in these accounts

529
00:23:08,870 --> 00:23:06,720
and one of the things I always find

530
00:23:11,930 --> 00:23:08,880
difficult in talking about this with

531
00:23:14,570 --> 00:23:11,940
folks is that both are true they're

532
00:23:17,419 --> 00:23:14,580
highly idiosyncratic so they're just

533
00:23:19,580 --> 00:23:17,429
seemed to be tailored for you for

534
00:23:21,289 --> 00:23:19,590
something that you need but we can't say

535
00:23:24,140 --> 00:23:21,299
that scientifically all's we can say is

536
00:23:27,350 --> 00:23:24,150
that seems to be it but when we flip

537
00:23:30,350 --> 00:23:27,360
over on the other side you know I guess

538
00:23:32,750 --> 00:23:30,360
that doesn't mean we can't say some

539
00:23:34,789 --> 00:23:32,760
things with a certain degree of

540
00:23:37,340 --> 00:23:34,799
certainty you know I really always

541
00:23:39,710 --> 00:23:37,350
appreciate the work that dr. Jeff Long

542
00:23:41,600 --> 00:23:39,720
has done in compiling a lot of these

543
00:23:43,850 --> 00:23:41,610
accounts and statistically looking at

544
00:23:46,789 --> 00:23:43,860
them and you know back to the light and

545
00:23:50,360 --> 00:23:46,799
love thing overwhelmingly it is about

546
00:23:53,750 --> 00:23:50,370
light in love overwhelmingly it is about

547
00:23:56,720 --> 00:23:53,760
people experiencing God for lack of a

548
00:24:00,169 --> 00:23:56,730
better word spirit and light and III

549
00:24:03,380 --> 00:24:00,179
guess I'm torn between kind of playing

550
00:24:04,970 --> 00:24:03,390
at both sides I can jump over and argue

551
00:24:07,070 --> 00:24:04,980
either side and say hey you know it's

552
00:24:09,289 --> 00:24:07,080
not all light love remember that person

553
00:24:13,250 --> 00:24:09,299
that saw hell and then I can jump over

554
00:24:14,900 --> 00:24:13,260
on the other side and say yeah but 80 90

555
00:24:16,810 --> 00:24:14,910
percent of the time it really is about

556
00:24:19,789 --> 00:24:16,820
light and love it really is about this

557
00:24:22,700 --> 00:24:19,799
transformative powerful experience that

558
00:24:25,370 --> 00:24:22,710
tells us that the deepest questions we

559
00:24:29,289 --> 00:24:25,380
have about who we are and why we're here

560
00:24:32,630 --> 00:24:29,299
are answered in a very deeply positive

561
00:24:37,250 --> 00:24:32,640
spiritual way so you want to speak to

562
00:24:39,919 --> 00:24:37,260
that to how we deal with both aspects of

563
00:24:41,770 --> 00:24:39,929
that well that's it with a positive and

564
00:24:43,909 --> 00:24:41,780
because there is that such a

565
00:24:44,870 --> 00:24:43,919
transformation in the way that they are

566
00:24:47,030 --> 00:24:44,880
afterwards

567
00:24:49,070 --> 00:24:47,040
all of a sudden their life isn't just

568
00:24:51,590 --> 00:24:49,080
about them at the center of their own

569
00:24:54,290 --> 00:24:51,600
little world they see themselves as part

570
00:24:55,610 --> 00:24:54,300
of this great interconnected whole and

571
00:24:58,490 --> 00:24:55,620
so it's about B

572
00:25:01,880 --> 00:24:58,500
of service to others and doing good for

573
00:25:03,770 --> 00:25:01,890
others as well and so the benefits of it

574
00:25:05,960 --> 00:25:03,780
as well can be far-reaching so it's not

575
00:25:08,150 --> 00:25:05,970
just about their own personal gain it's

576
00:25:09,770 --> 00:25:08,160
about how they can help others but not

577
00:25:11,270 --> 00:25:09,780
only just people around them as well

578
00:25:13,640 --> 00:25:11,280
they have a greater concern for the

579
00:25:16,580 --> 00:25:13,650
planet and they can take a step back and

580
00:25:19,850 --> 00:25:16,590
look at how human behavior is affecting

581
00:25:21,560 --> 00:25:19,860
our lovely planet that we live on and so

582
00:25:24,260 --> 00:25:21,570
they see things are from a totally

583
00:25:25,670 --> 00:25:24,270
different perspective as well and you

584
00:25:27,500 --> 00:25:25,680
know that is something again that is

585
00:25:30,650 --> 00:25:27,510
potentially measurable because there was

586
00:25:32,570 --> 00:25:30,660
that study done in 1998 by growth

587
00:25:36,440 --> 00:25:32,580
monitor and summers who looked at

588
00:25:39,650 --> 00:25:36,450
patients who would survived a near-death

589
00:25:41,120 --> 00:25:39,660
episode you know and so some people that

590
00:25:43,880 --> 00:25:41,130
they compared the group who'd had a

591
00:25:45,650 --> 00:25:43,890
near-death experience with people who

592
00:25:47,930 --> 00:25:45,660
had survived death but didn't have a

593
00:25:50,090 --> 00:25:47,940
near-death experience and they found

594
00:25:53,030 --> 00:25:50,100
that you know their conclusions were

595
00:25:55,549 --> 00:25:53,040
that it was there were marked changes in

596
00:25:56,650 --> 00:25:55,559
both groups but even more so within the

597
00:25:59,840 --> 00:25:56,660
group that had had the near-death

598
00:26:02,270 --> 00:25:59,850
experiences and they concluded that it

599
00:26:05,030 --> 00:26:02,280
was the near-death experiences itself

600
00:26:09,169 --> 00:26:05,040
that I didn't to instigated those great

601
00:26:10,760 --> 00:26:09,179
changes you know and and the examples of

602
00:26:13,160 --> 00:26:10,770
people in the book of what they're doing

603
00:26:15,820 --> 00:26:13,170
now you know you look at Kelly my

604
00:26:18,049 --> 00:26:15,830
co-author and she has such wonderful

605
00:26:20,120 --> 00:26:18,059
ideas you know for this animated

606
00:26:22,850 --> 00:26:20,130
character a cartoon character of

607
00:26:24,799 --> 00:26:22,860
positivity princess and and all the

608
00:26:26,720 --> 00:26:24,809
merchandize and things like that and

609
00:26:29,270 --> 00:26:26,730
what she's doing instead of making

610
00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:29,280
millions for herself which is that great

611
00:26:35,660 --> 00:26:32,010
potential what she wants to do is to

612
00:26:38,090 --> 00:26:35,670
turn her ideas into making money to help

613
00:26:39,919 --> 00:26:38,100
other people and that's you know that I

614
00:26:42,380 --> 00:26:39,929
think that is just amazing it's not

615
00:26:44,660 --> 00:26:42,390
about who it's about how we can

616
00:26:48,350 --> 00:26:44,670
integrate and help on a global scale as

617
00:26:49,820 --> 00:26:48,360
well and you know it's not just Kelly

618
00:26:51,919 --> 00:26:49,830
there's other examples of what people

619
00:26:55,160 --> 00:26:51,929
have done as a result of their

620
00:26:59,419 --> 00:26:55,170
experience like Kim Gigi for example in

621
00:27:01,220 --> 00:26:59,429
Chapter two she struggled for well good

622
00:27:03,620 --> 00:27:01,230
few years trying to come to terms with

623
00:27:06,770 --> 00:27:03,630
her near-death experience and she

624
00:27:08,820 --> 00:27:06,780
recognized that need for support now in

625
00:27:11,670 --> 00:27:08,830
America you do have

626
00:27:14,220 --> 00:27:11,680
i an't the International Association of

627
00:27:16,800 --> 00:27:14,230
near-death studies but in the UK we

628
00:27:19,320 --> 00:27:16,810
don't have that you know many years ago

629
00:27:22,170 --> 00:27:19,330
there was at a support group but that's

630
00:27:26,700 --> 00:27:22,180
not been running for many years and so

631
00:27:29,250 --> 00:27:26,710
Gigi now has set up n de UK and that's

632
00:27:31,470 --> 00:27:29,260
beginning to grow and that's what she's

633
00:27:33,540 --> 00:27:31,480
hoping now we can do is to grow that and

634
00:27:35,730 --> 00:27:33,550
it could be a hub where people can meet

635
00:27:38,580 --> 00:27:35,740
her but also where therapists who

636
00:27:40,590 --> 00:27:38,590
specialize in near-death experiences can

637
00:27:42,930 --> 00:27:40,600
be available so that people can be

638
00:27:47,010 --> 00:27:42,940
directed to go through the health and

639
00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:47,020
support let me bring up a couple of

640
00:27:52,500 --> 00:27:49,930
other issues that have come up for me

641
00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:52,510
over the years of covering the kind of

642
00:27:56,490 --> 00:27:54,610
near-death experience research that

643
00:27:58,610 --> 00:27:56,500
you've really been right at the center

644
00:28:01,980 --> 00:27:58,620
in for years and years which is is

645
00:28:05,130 --> 00:28:01,990
tremendous because when you do talk

646
00:28:07,140 --> 00:28:05,140
about this very inspirational book that

647
00:28:09,810 --> 00:28:07,150
you know by the way I don't think I'd

648
00:28:11,310 --> 00:28:09,820
encourage anyone just go to Amazon and

649
00:28:13,530 --> 00:28:11,320
just start reading it you know you can

650
00:28:16,860 --> 00:28:13,540
freely look inside and look at it you

651
00:28:19,230 --> 00:28:16,870
won't be able to stop I mean that is the

652
00:28:22,650 --> 00:28:19,240
awesome thing with these near-death

653
00:28:24,660 --> 00:28:22,660
experience accounts we can tell you that

654
00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:24,670
they're transformative and that they're

655
00:28:29,250 --> 00:28:26,650
positive and that they're live and love

656
00:28:31,140 --> 00:28:29,260
and they make you feel hopeful and

657
00:28:34,710 --> 00:28:31,150
better and all those things but you just

658
00:28:40,380 --> 00:28:34,720
have to go read them to get a flavor for

659
00:28:42,510 --> 00:28:40,390
it now having said that I've done you

660
00:28:45,450 --> 00:28:42,520
know what comes to mind is a couple of

661
00:28:48,980 --> 00:28:45,460
shows that I did with folks who had a

662
00:28:52,020 --> 00:28:48,990
very intense near-death experience

663
00:28:53,850 --> 00:28:52,030
connected to Jesus and that was

664
00:28:56,190 --> 00:28:53,860
spiritually transformative at a very

665
00:28:58,980 --> 00:28:56,200
Christian way and then of course they

666
00:29:00,570 --> 00:28:58,990
took it in a very dogmatic way houses

667
00:29:02,910 --> 00:29:00,580
one guy from Australia thank God he's

668
00:29:04,890 --> 00:29:02,920
from Australia he's not from the US the

669
00:29:06,570 --> 00:29:04,900
US Christian thing on him but you know

670
00:29:08,160 --> 00:29:06,580
he runs around all these churches around

671
00:29:09,750 --> 00:29:08,170
the world and then all these other

672
00:29:12,840 --> 00:29:09,760
people have Christian your death

673
00:29:14,960 --> 00:29:12,850
experiences and he is very keen and very

674
00:29:19,290 --> 00:29:14,970
aggressive with the idea that this

675
00:29:22,170 --> 00:29:19,300
experience is fundamentally a Christian

676
00:29:22,620 --> 00:29:22,180
experience and it supports the primacy

677
00:29:26,550 --> 00:29:22,630
of

678
00:29:28,320 --> 00:29:26,560
Christianity and my pushback was that's

679
00:29:29,760 --> 00:29:28,330
just not what the data says you know so

680
00:29:32,720 --> 00:29:29,770
you can go out there and blab that all

681
00:29:37,320 --> 00:29:32,730
you want but this is where we do need

682
00:29:39,390 --> 00:29:37,330
science to interface with spirituality

683
00:29:41,310 --> 00:29:39,400
because I'm not saying hey maybe he's

684
00:29:43,770 --> 00:29:41,320
right you know and and maybe Jesus is

685
00:29:46,380 --> 00:29:43,780
gonna point his shake his finger at me

686
00:29:49,980 --> 00:29:46,390
when I get up there but I look at the

687
00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:49,990
data the evidence overwhelmingly it says

688
00:29:56,160 --> 00:29:52,210
that this is this cannot be pigeonholed

689
00:29:57,540 --> 00:29:56,170
into a specific religious experience but

690
00:29:59,220 --> 00:29:57,550
again back to the negative here's

691
00:30:00,720 --> 00:29:59,230
somebody who's very much doing that has

692
00:30:03,540 --> 00:30:00,730
a lot of support for it from a lot of

693
00:30:05,160 --> 00:30:03,550
people so a couple issues there to talk

694
00:30:09,660 --> 00:30:05,170
about go wherever you want to grab it

695
00:30:11,790 --> 00:30:09,670
yes they occur in every different

696
00:30:13,770 --> 00:30:11,800
culture you know and they're they're

697
00:30:17,580 --> 00:30:13,780
interpreted according to the culture of

698
00:30:20,580 --> 00:30:17,590
that person and so they can you know for

699
00:30:22,890 --> 00:30:20,590
example in India the cultural kind of

700
00:30:24,960 --> 00:30:22,900
experience is meeting up with their

701
00:30:26,940 --> 00:30:24,970
young suits or yamatoots which are

702
00:30:29,580 --> 00:30:26,950
messengers of Yama the god of the dead

703
00:30:32,850 --> 00:30:29,590
and instead of the life review they kind

704
00:30:33,480 --> 00:30:32,860
of have that they meet up with

705
00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:33,490
chitragupt

706
00:30:38,910 --> 00:30:36,250
the man with the book of Deeds and so he

707
00:30:40,860 --> 00:30:38,920
looks in the book to see what they've

708
00:30:43,200 --> 00:30:40,870
kind of done with their life as well and

709
00:30:45,750 --> 00:30:43,210
that is very similar to the life review

710
00:30:47,610 --> 00:30:45,760
so I think people can interpret it

711
00:30:50,580 --> 00:30:47,620
according to their experience so it's

712
00:30:53,550 --> 00:30:50,590
almost as if they they're tapping into

713
00:30:55,620 --> 00:30:53,560
the collective unconscious and they're

714
00:30:59,190 --> 00:30:55,630
at interpreting the experience through

715
00:31:00,810 --> 00:30:59,200
their own cultural filter if you like so

716
00:31:03,000 --> 00:31:00,820
the you know the gal you were talking

717
00:31:04,500 --> 00:31:03,010
about the Australian guy he's kind of

718
00:31:07,110 --> 00:31:04,510
been brought up in a Christian tradition

719
00:31:09,390 --> 00:31:07,120
he's interpreted it in that way as well

720
00:31:11,730 --> 00:31:09,400
but he would say no penny I mean yeah

721
00:31:14,610 --> 00:31:11,740
he's heard all that and he says no you

722
00:31:17,820 --> 00:31:14,620
don't get it it is about it is about

723
00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:17,830
Jesus and I spoke with Jesus and I asked

724
00:31:24,510 --> 00:31:20,890
Jesus about that and Jesus said no it's

725
00:31:26,490 --> 00:31:24,520
this so you in here is I think the

726
00:31:28,710 --> 00:31:26,500
problem in the interface with science in

727
00:31:30,930 --> 00:31:28,720
that you know people like you real

728
00:31:34,290 --> 00:31:30,940
scientists you've looked at that we've

729
00:31:36,080 --> 00:31:34,300
kept you just on a spinning on prove it

730
00:31:38,960 --> 00:31:36,090
prove it prove it prove it prove it

731
00:31:41,750 --> 00:31:38,970
to the extent that we haven't been able

732
00:31:44,450 --> 00:31:41,760
to really look at some of these deeper

733
00:31:47,149 --> 00:31:44,460
questions but there's some real deep

734
00:31:49,430 --> 00:31:47,159
questions here in terms of you know back

735
00:31:51,049 --> 00:31:49,440
to the idiosyncratic nature of this what

736
00:31:52,820 --> 00:31:51,059
does it mean that they're so answer

737
00:31:55,880 --> 00:31:52,830
idiosyncratic what does it mean that

738
00:32:00,110 --> 00:31:55,890
this guy's experience he's not making it

739
00:32:02,120 --> 00:32:00,120
up it is it is distinctly Christian in a

740
00:32:04,700 --> 00:32:02,130
way that if I'm gonna kind of defend him

741
00:32:06,830 --> 00:32:04,710
a little bit he cannot get away from the

742
00:32:09,110 --> 00:32:06,840
fact that it is distinctly Christian it

743
00:32:12,889 --> 00:32:09,120
isn't saying it's you know it's

744
00:32:17,480 --> 00:32:12,899
Christian but it can be Hindu to know it

745
00:32:19,610 --> 00:32:17,490
was purely Christian that's a really

746
00:32:21,289 --> 00:32:19,620
really good point because how do we get

747
00:32:23,899 --> 00:32:21,299
to the bottom of those things as well

748
00:32:26,750 --> 00:32:23,909
then you know because we've kind of by

749
00:32:28,549 --> 00:32:26,760
focusing on just the scientific we're

750
00:32:30,139 --> 00:32:28,559
not looking at questions like that

751
00:32:32,060 --> 00:32:30,149
either you know so I think that is

752
00:32:34,430 --> 00:32:32,070
definitely something that we have to get

753
00:32:37,279 --> 00:32:34,440
beyond and and to answer those important

754
00:32:39,490 --> 00:32:37,289
questions as well so would we begin to I

755
00:32:42,889 --> 00:32:39,500
mean do you have any thoughts on how we

756
00:32:45,710 --> 00:32:42,899
what would be that next level of

757
00:32:51,409 --> 00:32:45,720
research that would help us probe some

758
00:32:53,899 --> 00:32:51,419
of those questions I think maybe what

759
00:32:56,630 --> 00:32:53,909
would be great it would be to have like

760
00:32:58,970 --> 00:32:56,640
a universal group of researchers from

761
00:33:01,610 --> 00:32:58,980
all different cultures I think that

762
00:33:04,370 --> 00:33:01,620
would be so powerful if we got people

763
00:33:06,230 --> 00:33:04,380
from all different cultures to all get

764
00:33:08,659 --> 00:33:06,240
together and pool their kind of

765
00:33:10,279 --> 00:33:08,669
resources and and to share their

766
00:33:12,470 --> 00:33:10,289
thoughts amongst it as well get some

767
00:33:14,450 --> 00:33:12,480
sort of real kind of working group

768
00:33:16,909 --> 00:33:14,460
together rather than people doing it in

769
00:33:20,029 --> 00:33:16,919
isolation as well it's working together

770
00:33:22,039 --> 00:33:20,039
in unity and then discussing the ideas

771
00:33:26,149 --> 00:33:22,049
as well not just within that group but

772
00:33:30,730 --> 00:33:26,159
also very publicly as well you know

773
00:33:35,450 --> 00:33:30,740
putting a related question I think is

774
00:33:38,799 --> 00:33:35,460
you're battling against a medical

775
00:33:43,340 --> 00:33:38,809
institution that has a lot at stake in

776
00:33:45,770 --> 00:33:43,350
not giving up not giving in to what

777
00:33:48,830 --> 00:33:45,780
you're talking about I mean whether we

778
00:33:50,010 --> 00:33:48,840
like it or not the the the medical

779
00:33:52,860 --> 00:33:50,020
institution

780
00:33:55,520 --> 00:33:52,870
built this death machine and this fear

781
00:33:58,440 --> 00:33:55,530
of death that we have completely is

782
00:34:01,230 --> 00:33:58,450
integrated into it and without getting

783
00:34:04,800 --> 00:34:01,240
into who's to blame for that or whatever

784
00:34:06,270 --> 00:34:04,810
that that is the nature of the game that

785
00:34:08,639 --> 00:34:06,280
it's played you know if death must be

786
00:34:11,820 --> 00:34:08,649
avoided at all costs and oh we fear

787
00:34:14,340 --> 00:34:11,830
death and oh my gosh your your mother is

788
00:34:17,790 --> 00:34:14,350
going to die you know that the hole it's

789
00:34:24,120 --> 00:34:17,800
in there all over the place but there is

790
00:34:28,110 --> 00:34:24,130
so that materialistic science I guess I

791
00:34:31,440 --> 00:34:28,120
sometimes struggle with the fact that

792
00:34:33,830 --> 00:34:31,450
there seems to be a reality to that as

793
00:34:36,750 --> 00:34:33,840
well as part of the near-death

794
00:34:37,980 --> 00:34:36,760
experience and up before I get too far

795
00:34:40,800 --> 00:34:37,990
afield because I want you to talk about

796
00:34:43,380 --> 00:34:40,810
that first part in the death culture of

797
00:34:48,620 --> 00:34:43,390
medicine but I also want you to talk

798
00:34:51,270 --> 00:34:48,630
about you know we do bump into some

799
00:34:52,590 --> 00:34:51,280
material materialistic science kind of

800
00:34:54,149 --> 00:34:52,600
thinks when we say hey we're

801
00:34:59,180 --> 00:34:54,159
resuscitating people and we're seeing

802
00:35:01,560 --> 00:34:59,190
more in de's why what why does God need

803
00:35:04,860 --> 00:35:01,570
resuscitation to who to bring forth

804
00:35:06,420 --> 00:35:04,870
ideas right I mean what why is there at

805
00:35:09,450 --> 00:35:06,430
every turn this there's this kind of

806
00:35:13,680 --> 00:35:09,460
double double take like well that does

807
00:35:17,240 --> 00:35:13,690
imply a biological trigger or component

808
00:35:22,530 --> 00:35:17,250
to it so are the the Deaf culture

809
00:35:23,940 --> 00:35:22,540
medicine people right in a way oh I

810
00:35:27,360 --> 00:35:23,950
don't know I think that was one of the

811
00:35:29,220 --> 00:35:27,370
biggest things really that was one of my

812
00:35:31,680 --> 00:35:29,230
wake-up calls because you know working

813
00:35:36,600 --> 00:35:31,690
in intensive care you do see that death

814
00:35:38,160 --> 00:35:36,610
denial totally all the time and it's you

815
00:35:40,980 --> 00:35:38,170
know that that patient I mentioned in

816
00:35:44,070 --> 00:35:40,990
the beginning it was what he knew he was

817
00:35:46,050 --> 00:35:44,080
dying he wanted me to leave him alone to

818
00:35:47,910 --> 00:35:46,060
let him die in peace and I knew that I

819
00:35:50,280 --> 00:35:47,920
had to treat him because that was my job

820
00:35:54,120 --> 00:35:50,290
to do that I had no choice and the man

821
00:35:56,310 --> 00:35:54,130
wanted to die and you know it's and then

822
00:35:57,810 --> 00:35:56,320
after that I became a little bit

823
00:36:00,900 --> 00:35:57,820
depressed after that and every time I

824
00:36:03,690 --> 00:36:00,910
went into work I would see patients who

825
00:36:06,750 --> 00:36:03,700
would die in there was no kind of long

826
00:36:09,420 --> 00:36:06,760
thing for them at all and yet we were

827
00:36:12,690 --> 00:36:09,430
still treating them with all of the

828
00:36:15,510 --> 00:36:12,700
different medications or everything in

829
00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:15,520
an attempt to stop them from dying and

830
00:36:19,710 --> 00:36:18,010
death is the most natural thing in the

831
00:36:22,020 --> 00:36:19,720
world it's going to happen to every one

832
00:36:24,870 --> 00:36:22,030
of us and we just don't think about it

833
00:36:26,910 --> 00:36:24,880
at all and I think as a society if we

834
00:36:29,130 --> 00:36:26,920
thought about our own mortality a bit

835
00:36:31,140 --> 00:36:29,140
more and thought about what death is

836
00:36:33,240 --> 00:36:31,150
then it would give us a completely

837
00:36:34,319 --> 00:36:33,250
different understanding of life because

838
00:36:37,620 --> 00:36:34,329
that's what it's done for me

839
00:36:39,870 --> 00:36:37,630
you know my research has taught me so

840
00:36:42,000 --> 00:36:39,880
much about life and in fact my research

841
00:36:43,950 --> 00:36:42,010
has really empowered me and when I

842
00:36:45,720 --> 00:36:43,960
started off on it my friends they were

843
00:36:48,210 --> 00:36:45,730
saying penny you must be so depressed

844
00:36:50,400 --> 00:36:48,220
what a depressing and morbid subject to

845
00:36:53,220 --> 00:36:50,410
talk about or in fact you know I've

846
00:36:56,099 --> 00:36:53,230
never been so empowered and felt really

847
00:36:57,599 --> 00:36:56,109
I did not happy if you like as a result

848
00:37:00,540 --> 00:36:57,609
of learning what I've learned from my

849
00:37:03,960 --> 00:37:00,550
studying of death so well I think

850
00:37:06,930 --> 00:37:03,970
removing that fear of death which

851
00:37:09,780 --> 00:37:06,940
near-death experience science does for

852
00:37:12,079 --> 00:37:09,790
so many people it and and I am careful

853
00:37:15,000 --> 00:37:12,089
in using the word science there because

854
00:37:16,950 --> 00:37:15,010
we know documented cases that the

855
00:37:21,569 --> 00:37:16,960
near-death experience that is people who

856
00:37:26,520 --> 00:37:21,579
have it have this reduction in fear of

857
00:37:28,670 --> 00:37:26,530
death but the real prize is that the

858
00:37:31,620 --> 00:37:28,680
study of near-death experience science

859
00:37:35,670 --> 00:37:31,630
buying the transformative power of

860
00:37:38,099 --> 00:37:35,680
near-death experiences will reduce your

861
00:37:39,750 --> 00:37:38,109
fear of death and that's a good thing

862
00:37:43,800 --> 00:37:39,760
because a lot of people carry around a

863
00:37:45,540 --> 00:37:43,810
lot of anxiety on a daily basis about

864
00:37:47,339 --> 00:37:45,550
death and it's it's sometimes it's not

865
00:37:49,800 --> 00:37:47,349
even you know at the forefront of their

866
00:37:53,130 --> 00:37:49,810
mind it's just kind of gnawing hit the

867
00:37:55,170 --> 00:37:53,140
back of their mind yeah and you know

868
00:37:57,329 --> 00:37:55,180
it's something I've never really kind of

869
00:37:59,370 --> 00:37:57,339
thought of in-depth and when I started

870
00:38:01,680 --> 00:37:59,380
reading these experiences and thought

871
00:38:02,339 --> 00:38:01,690
wow and they're really engaged with them

872
00:38:03,809 --> 00:38:02,349
as well

873
00:38:07,890 --> 00:38:03,819
and it's given me a different

874
00:38:10,050 --> 00:38:07,900
perspective now on my own kind of death

875
00:38:12,480 --> 00:38:10,060
as well and I know I'm gonna die I don't

876
00:38:15,390 --> 00:38:12,490
know where and I don't know how but I

877
00:38:17,550 --> 00:38:15,400
think you know where when it happens

878
00:38:20,460 --> 00:38:17,560
I think the

879
00:38:22,080 --> 00:38:20,470
and the IOT I might have felt perhaps

880
00:38:25,020 --> 00:38:22,090
won't be there because I've got some

881
00:38:27,600 --> 00:38:25,030
insight into what to expect you know

882
00:38:29,550 --> 00:38:27,610
whether it plays out like that

883
00:38:31,610 --> 00:38:29,560
I don't know but to be honest with you I

884
00:38:34,890 --> 00:38:31,620
really it's something that I'm not

885
00:38:37,200 --> 00:38:34,900
fearful of I'm not even fearful of the

886
00:38:39,660 --> 00:38:37,210
actual transition itself but perhaps

887
00:38:42,180 --> 00:38:39,670
more about the mode in which I die

888
00:38:45,180 --> 00:38:42,190
maybe you know but it's really made me

889
00:38:47,430 --> 00:38:45,190
consider my own mortality you know penny

890
00:38:48,840 --> 00:38:47,440
we kind of skip past that that one

891
00:38:53,750 --> 00:38:48,850
question I really want to get your

892
00:38:56,640 --> 00:38:53,760
thoughts on it what about the the

893
00:38:59,330 --> 00:38:56,650
materialistic nature of some of this

894
00:39:01,950 --> 00:38:59,340
stuff the biological nature that the

895
00:39:03,600 --> 00:39:01,960
science as we know it nature this like I

896
00:39:07,020 --> 00:39:03,610
said the fact that there's more

897
00:39:08,940 --> 00:39:07,030
near-death experiences as we resuscitate

898
00:39:11,490 --> 00:39:08,950
people suggests that there is a

899
00:39:13,850 --> 00:39:11,500
biological component you know my friend

900
00:39:16,920 --> 00:39:13,860
Zack had a question he sent over about

901
00:39:19,440 --> 00:39:16,930
people who don't have sight have a

902
00:39:22,610 --> 00:39:19,450
different kind of near-death experience

903
00:39:27,150 --> 00:39:22,620
there's all these different aspects of

904
00:39:30,120 --> 00:39:27,160
our physical being that then translate

905
00:39:34,530 --> 00:39:30,130
into the experience in a way that's hard

906
00:39:38,610 --> 00:39:34,540
to really totally make sense of if it's

907
00:39:40,920 --> 00:39:38,620
completely a spiritual experience so

908
00:39:45,000 --> 00:39:40,930
what do you think is going on in this

909
00:39:48,210 --> 00:39:45,010
interplay between the spiritual and the

910
00:39:51,030 --> 00:39:48,220
physical I don't know I think there's

911
00:39:55,020 --> 00:39:51,040
like loads of different triggers for

912
00:39:57,060 --> 00:39:55,030
these experiences as well and you know

913
00:40:00,990 --> 00:39:57,070
one of them is that the fact that we're

914
00:40:03,150 --> 00:40:01,000
able to more people are survived in a

915
00:40:05,820 --> 00:40:03,160
critical illness and a cardiac arrest

916
00:40:08,730 --> 00:40:05,830
than what would have been many years ago

917
00:40:10,890 --> 00:40:08,740
you know our science our technology has

918
00:40:13,710 --> 00:40:10,900
all developed now and we've got much

919
00:40:17,460 --> 00:40:13,720
great better resuscitation techniques

920
00:40:21,150 --> 00:40:17,470
we've got better medical equipment and

921
00:40:23,910 --> 00:40:21,160
things which are all helping people to

922
00:40:26,610 --> 00:40:23,920
have a greater survival rate of these

923
00:40:28,260 --> 00:40:26,620
things and I think more and more people

924
00:40:30,960 --> 00:40:28,270
barely survive in these critical

925
00:40:31,350 --> 00:40:30,970
illnesses so more and more people report

926
00:40:33,680 --> 00:40:31,360
in the

927
00:40:36,450 --> 00:40:33,690
death experiences but from a wider

928
00:40:39,690 --> 00:40:36,460
perspective I've come to think that

929
00:40:41,870 --> 00:40:39,700
we've got undergoing a global Awakening

930
00:40:46,170 --> 00:40:41,880
and I think these experiences are

931
00:40:48,420 --> 00:40:46,180
showing us are waking us all and I think

932
00:40:50,730 --> 00:40:48,430
because more people are experiencing the

933
00:40:53,400 --> 00:40:50,740
near-death experience more people are

934
00:40:55,380 --> 00:40:53,410
being aware of them we've got the

935
00:40:58,230 --> 00:40:55,390
internet now so it's easier to share

936
00:40:59,580 --> 00:40:58,240
your experience and more and more people

937
00:41:01,710 --> 00:40:59,590
are taking an interest in the

938
00:41:04,020 --> 00:41:01,720
experiences and I think what we're

939
00:41:06,060 --> 00:41:04,030
seeing is that shift of an attitude

940
00:41:08,520 --> 00:41:06,070
because I've definitely noticed that

941
00:41:11,040 --> 00:41:08,530
since I began my research you know and I

942
00:41:12,810 --> 00:41:11,050
first started it it was very difficult

943
00:41:15,450 --> 00:41:12,820
to find people who would share their

944
00:41:17,550 --> 00:41:15,460
experience but over the years more and

945
00:41:19,440 --> 00:41:17,560
more people have begun to engage with me

946
00:41:21,810 --> 00:41:19,450
and when my last book came out the

947
00:41:24,270 --> 00:41:21,820
wisdom of near-death experiences I was

948
00:41:26,850 --> 00:41:24,280
just inundated with emails and I've

949
00:41:29,130 --> 00:41:26,860
still got over 14,000 email service

950
00:41:32,100 --> 00:41:29,140
reply to because it's a full-time job in

951
00:41:34,950 --> 00:41:32,110
itself reply into these emails so I

952
00:41:37,650 --> 00:41:34,960
think what we're seeing on a wider scale

953
00:41:39,480 --> 00:41:37,660
is that we undergo in a big awakening

954
00:41:42,270 --> 00:41:39,490
and I think that there are people who

955
00:41:44,820 --> 00:41:42,280
are still in denial of the reality of

956
00:41:46,470 --> 00:41:44,830
these kind of experiences but I think

957
00:41:48,390 --> 00:41:46,480
there's going to be far more people who

958
00:41:51,870 --> 00:41:48,400
are really going to be waking up to what

959
00:41:55,320 --> 00:41:51,880
these experiences is all really see I I

960
00:41:58,650 --> 00:41:55,330
just really have a problem with that it

961
00:42:02,370 --> 00:41:58,660
just maybe but maybe not

962
00:42:05,220 --> 00:42:02,380
I feel like there's such a cultural

963
00:42:11,220 --> 00:42:05,230
overlay that we do on that you know I

964
00:42:14,730 --> 00:42:11,230
mean if you live in Tibet and you have a

965
00:42:17,790 --> 00:42:14,740
tradition of reincarnation for hundreds

966
00:42:20,550 --> 00:42:17,800
of years is this whole thing even kind

967
00:42:25,170 --> 00:42:20,560
of meaningful you to you or if you live

968
00:42:28,140 --> 00:42:25,180
in some country that's torn by Civil War

969
00:42:30,870 --> 00:42:28,150
and you're just trying to survive is any

970
00:42:33,270 --> 00:42:30,880
of this stuff meaning free meaningful to

971
00:42:37,770 --> 00:42:33,280
you and I hear this you know all the

972
00:42:40,950 --> 00:42:37,780
time this consciousness revolution and I

973
00:42:43,830 --> 00:42:40,960
get it on one hand I definitely see it

974
00:42:45,090 --> 00:42:43,840
in what I've done for the last ten years

975
00:42:49,140 --> 00:42:45,100
as well but

976
00:42:50,850 --> 00:42:49,150
I'm skeptical too I mean how long we

977
00:42:53,100 --> 00:42:50,860
don't even know our history

978
00:42:56,130 --> 00:42:53,110
well our history of being on this planet

979
00:42:57,690 --> 00:42:56,140
for ten thousand years or six thousand

980
00:43:00,360 --> 00:42:57,700
years or twenty thousand years or a

981
00:43:04,590 --> 00:43:00,370
million years or ten million years we

982
00:43:09,030 --> 00:43:04,600
have no clue so how could we begin to

983
00:43:11,880 --> 00:43:09,040
even try and pinpoint this trend that's

984
00:43:15,150 --> 00:43:11,890
happened in such a short period of time

985
00:43:19,350 --> 00:43:15,160
do you share any of those concerns when

986
00:43:22,560 --> 00:43:19,360
we start overlaying these big picture

987
00:43:24,210 --> 00:43:22,570
patterns on what's happening and again I

988
00:43:25,890 --> 00:43:24,220
just gotta throw in one more thing you

989
00:43:26,550 --> 00:43:25,900
know God really needs our help on this

990
00:43:28,790 --> 00:43:26,560
one right

991
00:43:31,260 --> 00:43:28,800
God really needs our help on this

992
00:43:33,060 --> 00:43:31,270
consciousness transformation couldn't do

993
00:43:35,340 --> 00:43:33,070
it without couldn't do it on his own he

994
00:43:36,810 --> 00:43:35,350
really had it had to pull us in and

995
00:43:38,850 --> 00:43:36,820
write these books a near-death

996
00:43:42,090 --> 00:43:38,860
experience somehow that just doesn't

997
00:43:43,980 --> 00:43:42,100
that doesn't wash do you think our

998
00:43:46,440 --> 00:43:43,990
consciousness could be evolved into the

999
00:43:49,050 --> 00:43:46,450
next level you know I these are just

1000
00:43:50,760 --> 00:43:49,060
ideas that kind of make sense to me at

1001
00:43:51,810 --> 00:43:50,770
the moment I might kind of do more

1002
00:43:54,660 --> 00:43:51,820
research and think completely

1003
00:43:56,550 --> 00:43:54,670
differently in a few years time so it's

1004
00:43:59,010 --> 00:43:56,560
just the way of making sense of the data

1005
00:44:01,010 --> 00:43:59,020
at this point in time and I think you

1006
00:44:03,270 --> 00:44:01,020
know that can change so drastically

1007
00:44:06,210 --> 00:44:03,280
according to what are the discoveries we

1008
00:44:07,950 --> 00:44:06,220
make as well so I have to keep as open

1009
00:44:10,440 --> 00:44:07,960
the mind as possible and it kind of

1010
00:44:12,810 --> 00:44:10,450
explore all sort of possibilities as

1011
00:44:14,460 --> 00:44:12,820
well and I think the thing that to me at

1012
00:44:17,040 --> 00:44:14,470
the moment is making sense is that

1013
00:44:19,590 --> 00:44:17,050
perhaps our consciousness is evolved

1014
00:44:21,360 --> 00:44:19,600
into that next level and perhaps that's

1015
00:44:24,240 --> 00:44:21,370
why more and more people beginning to

1016
00:44:27,680 --> 00:44:24,250
have near-death experiences and also

1017
00:44:30,750 --> 00:44:27,690
spiritually transformative experiences I

1018
00:44:32,970 --> 00:44:30,760
don't know fair enough I love that I

1019
00:44:36,180 --> 00:44:32,980
love that answer that the book let's

1020
00:44:38,850 --> 00:44:36,190
talk about one more story chapter in the

1021
00:44:41,550 --> 00:44:38,860
book before I let you go I really like

1022
00:44:44,550 --> 00:44:41,560
the chapter that Christa wrote on beyond

1023
00:44:47,550 --> 00:44:44,560
heaven because it had so many of the

1024
00:44:49,680 --> 00:44:47,560
aspects of what we're talking about one

1025
00:44:52,410 --> 00:44:49,690
I love the fact that she has this

1026
00:44:54,870 --> 00:44:52,420
download of information because I've

1027
00:44:57,510 --> 00:44:54,880
heard that from so many different people

1028
00:44:58,700 --> 00:44:57,520
that have had different experiences not

1029
00:45:00,770 --> 00:44:58,710
just near-death

1030
00:45:03,380 --> 00:45:00,780
Frances but psychedelic experiences

1031
00:45:05,329 --> 00:45:03,390
alien abduction experiences which is how

1032
00:45:07,910 --> 00:45:05,339
we won't even talk about but have to be

1033
00:45:10,010 --> 00:45:07,920
talked about have to be considered I

1034
00:45:12,530 --> 00:45:10,020
mean John Mack from Harvard study them

1035
00:45:15,370 --> 00:45:12,540
we can't study them but there's a lot of

1036
00:45:18,680 --> 00:45:15,380
people to talk about download of

1037
00:45:22,070 --> 00:45:18,690
information and what was fascinating to

1038
00:45:25,220 --> 00:45:22,080
me about Krista's download was it's

1039
00:45:27,800 --> 00:45:25,230
about love and so many spiritual people

1040
00:45:30,349 --> 00:45:27,810
throughout time and you can read their

1041
00:45:32,450 --> 00:45:30,359
amazing stories from hundreds of years

1042
00:45:36,410 --> 00:45:32,460
ago right up to the present have had a

1043
00:45:38,329 --> 00:45:36,420
similar download it's about love which

1044
00:45:41,630 --> 00:45:38,339
gets back to what this book is really

1045
00:45:45,170 --> 00:45:41,640
all about and the positivity but here's

1046
00:45:48,230 --> 00:45:45,180
the twist if you read folks Krista's

1047
00:45:50,329 --> 00:45:48,240
chapter in this book she also has a

1048
00:45:53,750 --> 00:45:50,339
distressing NDE she has the shadow

1049
00:45:56,120 --> 00:45:53,760
figures in there she also has what you

1050
00:45:57,230 --> 00:45:56,130
kind of touched on she has a lot of

1051
00:45:59,000 --> 00:45:57,240
problem integrating the near-death

1052
00:46:01,670 --> 00:45:59,010
experience back into her life and she

1053
00:46:03,380 --> 00:46:01,680
gets divorced and you're like gosh if

1054
00:46:05,660 --> 00:46:03,390
you're learning to love everybody you

1055
00:46:07,250 --> 00:46:05,670
can't you can't get along with that guy

1056
00:46:10,099 --> 00:46:07,260
you've been sleeping next to all this

1057
00:46:12,230 --> 00:46:10,109
time I mean really that was that was the

1058
00:46:15,200 --> 00:46:12,240
the upshot of the whole thing you know I

1059
00:46:18,170 --> 00:46:15,210
mean there's a lot of I love that I love

1060
00:46:22,390 --> 00:46:18,180
the complexity of it because life as

1061
00:46:25,430 --> 00:46:22,400
most of his experience it is more

1062
00:46:28,700 --> 00:46:25,440
complicated than just papering it over

1063
00:46:30,260 --> 00:46:28,710
with you know a big furry heart on our

1064
00:46:32,089 --> 00:46:30,270
chest and say we're all about light and

1065
00:46:34,310 --> 00:46:32,099
love so do you want to talk about that

1066
00:46:36,460 --> 00:46:34,320
chapter at all and about the download of

1067
00:46:38,870 --> 00:46:36,470
information and about the integration

1068
00:46:41,560 --> 00:46:38,880
yeah and I think the food thing the

1069
00:46:44,960 --> 00:46:41,570
really nice thing about Christmas

1070
00:46:48,079 --> 00:46:44,970
example as well is the fact that yeah

1071
00:46:49,579 --> 00:46:48,089
she did have that kind of she did split

1072
00:46:51,970 --> 00:46:49,589
with her husband and have that divorce

1073
00:46:53,839 --> 00:46:51,980
but they remain really best friends

1074
00:46:55,910 --> 00:46:53,849
throughout it as well

1075
00:46:57,670 --> 00:46:55,920
and they've still got that you know

1076
00:46:59,930 --> 00:46:57,680
you've still a link of love between

1077
00:47:02,450 --> 00:46:59,940
between you but another interesting

1078
00:47:04,670 --> 00:47:02,460
thing as well is that how she learned to

1079
00:47:08,480 --> 00:47:04,680
kind of deal with that experience and to

1080
00:47:11,240 --> 00:47:08,490
integrated and also she when I first met

1081
00:47:12,110 --> 00:47:11,250
Christo it was various and I watched her

1082
00:47:15,110 --> 00:47:12,120
one

1083
00:47:17,750 --> 00:47:15,120
videos on YouTube she had attended it

1084
00:47:21,680 --> 00:47:17,760
one of the irons conferences and I was

1085
00:47:23,660 --> 00:47:21,690
really blown away as to how she was able

1086
00:47:26,750 --> 00:47:23,670
to adapt what she learned in her

1087
00:47:28,490 --> 00:47:26,760
near-death experience into her medical

1088
00:47:30,680 --> 00:47:28,500
practice as well you know and so I think

1089
00:47:34,550 --> 00:47:30,690
she's really it's really great that

1090
00:47:36,320 --> 00:47:34,560
she's able to recognize other people who

1091
00:47:38,330 --> 00:47:36,330
had the experiences as well because she

1092
00:47:40,880 --> 00:47:38,340
can be of such great health and benefit

1093
00:47:43,670 --> 00:47:40,890
and again you know she was trained in

1094
00:47:45,710 --> 00:47:43,680
that very scientific mold and then

1095
00:47:48,530 --> 00:47:45,720
having that experience has opened her

1096
00:47:50,300 --> 00:47:48,540
eyes and you know given her a different

1097
00:47:53,750 --> 00:47:50,310
perspective on how she works as a

1098
00:47:56,240 --> 00:47:53,760
physician's assistant as well so you

1099
00:47:59,120 --> 00:47:56,250
know I think she's what her chapter is

1100
00:48:01,460 --> 00:47:59,130
really really great as well well there's

1101
00:48:03,980 --> 00:48:01,470
so many great chapters in the book

1102
00:48:06,290 --> 00:48:03,990
you're to be congratulated dr. Satori

1103
00:48:09,110 --> 00:48:06,300
it's it's terrific I really encourage

1104
00:48:10,790 --> 00:48:09,120
people like I say I don't even have to

1105
00:48:12,830 --> 00:48:10,800
tell you to buy it just go take a look

1106
00:48:16,010 --> 00:48:12,840
and everything will take care of itself

1107
00:48:19,940 --> 00:48:16,020
after that the transformative power of

1108
00:48:22,010 --> 00:48:19,950
near-death experiences anything else we

1109
00:48:23,750 --> 00:48:22,020
need to let people know I guess one

1110
00:48:27,440 --> 00:48:23,760
thing that you kind of touched on but

1111
00:48:29,990 --> 00:48:27,450
the the proceeds are going to charity is

1112
00:48:32,060 --> 00:48:30,000
that true yes that's right so all of the

1113
00:48:35,210 --> 00:48:32,070
royalties from the book will be given to

1114
00:48:37,340 --> 00:48:35,220
the Lev care share foundation and that

1115
00:48:40,750 --> 00:48:37,350
is a charity that was set up by Kelly

1116
00:48:43,820 --> 00:48:40,760
whilst my co-author and it's all about

1117
00:48:46,640 --> 00:48:43,830
supporting children's projects on a

1118
00:48:49,010 --> 00:48:46,650
global basis so it's about really

1119
00:48:51,740 --> 00:48:49,020
empowering young children so that they

1120
00:48:53,300 --> 00:48:51,750
grow up in a very supportive way and you

1121
00:48:55,400 --> 00:48:53,310
know all sorts of projects all around

1122
00:48:58,250 --> 00:48:55,410
the world so that's what we're hoping to

1123
00:49:00,170 --> 00:48:58,260
do is to kind of follow on with what

1124
00:49:03,440 --> 00:49:00,180
we've learned from our experiences and

1125
00:49:07,250 --> 00:49:03,450
continue to put it to good use put it

1126
00:49:09,740 --> 00:49:07,260
into action right well awesome oh thank

1127
00:49:11,630 --> 00:49:09,750
you again so much for joining me today

1128
00:49:14,360 --> 00:49:11,640
penny thank you Alex

1129
00:49:15,920 --> 00:49:14,370
best of luck with this book thank you

1130
00:49:17,570 --> 00:49:15,930
it's been great thanks again to dr.

1131
00:49:19,850 --> 00:49:17,580
Sartori for joining me today on

1132
00:49:23,030 --> 00:49:19,860
sceptical one question I guess I tee up

1133
00:49:24,349 --> 00:49:23,040
from this interview is what do you make

1134
00:49:27,380 --> 00:49:24,359
of the light and love

1135
00:49:29,930 --> 00:49:27,390
stuff can we hold on to that as

1136
00:49:32,390 --> 00:49:29,940
something that the near-death experience

1137
00:49:35,140 --> 00:49:32,400
science is telling us is that a

1138
00:49:37,900 --> 00:49:35,150
fundamental part of the near-death

1139
00:49:41,390 --> 00:49:37,910
experience or is it just another

1140
00:49:44,150 --> 00:49:41,400
cultural overlay another distraction

1141
00:49:45,380 --> 00:49:44,160
that we're drawn to because we want it

1142
00:49:47,509 --> 00:49:45,390
to be that way

1143
00:49:50,930 --> 00:49:47,519
I think these are the kind of important

1144
00:49:53,749 --> 00:49:50,940
level 2 questions that we never get to

1145
00:49:55,670 --> 00:49:53,759
the level 1 question being is near-death

1146
00:49:57,680 --> 00:49:55,680
experience really happening or is it

1147
00:50:00,979 --> 00:49:57,690
just the dying brain I mean how long

1148
00:50:04,370 --> 00:50:00,989
will the materialistic idiot scientific

1149
00:50:06,349 --> 00:50:04,380
medical morons keep us spinning our

1150
00:50:08,390 --> 00:50:06,359
wheels on that kind of question one

1151
00:50:11,170 --> 00:50:08,400
that's really been answered conclusively

1152
00:50:14,210 --> 00:50:11,180
so we can get on to these more

1153
00:50:16,460 --> 00:50:14,220
interesting questions so let's jump

1154
00:50:17,870 --> 00:50:16,470
ahead let's answer that question the

1155
00:50:20,059 --> 00:50:17,880
best we can let me know your thoughts

1156
00:50:21,710 --> 00:50:20,069
you can do it here you can do it through

1157
00:50:24,259 --> 00:50:21,720
this sceptical website on The Skeptical

1158
00:50:26,870 --> 00:50:24,269
forum any way you do it is fine with me

1159
00:50:28,519 --> 00:50:26,880
as long as you let me know what you

1160
00:50:30,200 --> 00:50:28,529
think that's gonna do it for this

1161
00:50:33,410 --> 00:50:30,210
episode of sceptical I have a number of

1162
00:50:35,839 --> 00:50:33,420
I think good shows coming up please stay

1163
00:50:39,799 --> 00:50:35,849
with me for all of that until next time

1164
00:50:41,779 --> 00:50:39,809
take care and bye for now so thanks for

1165
00:50:44,210 --> 00:50:41,789
watching this video if it wasn't really

1166
00:50:45,979 --> 00:50:44,220
a video but just an audio stored as a

1167
00:50:47,960 --> 00:50:45,989
video I apologize but there's more

1168
00:50:49,999 --> 00:50:47,970
videos out there as well but please

1169
00:50:51,470 --> 00:50:50,009
check out the Skeptical website you can

1170
00:50:53,109 --> 00:50:51,480
see it here we cover a lot of different

1171
00:50:56,089 --> 00:50:53,119
stuff you might be interested in

1172
00:50:58,910 --> 00:50:56,099
relating to controversial science and

1173
00:51:02,059 --> 00:50:58,920
spirituality a lot of shows up there

1174
00:51:05,120 --> 00:51:02,069
over 350 of them are so all free all

1175
00:51:06,360 --> 00:51:05,130
available for downloads so do check it